I can only assume the following 2 scenarios could be taking place:
1) Blizzard doesn't give a s**t about us and are trying to make the paladin look cool so loads of newbies will roll the class when TBC comes out. An example of trying to make them look cool is giving blood elf pictures on the TBC map tier 3 armor and a beefy 2 hander.
2) Blizzard are holding out on giving the paladin community any feedback because we will have the most. Perhaps they arent going to give us any feedback until TBC has been released and we will have the first class patch?
One of the posts made saying why do we even try anymore, my answer would be because the class has great potential and does function even though it has some of the worst downfalls of any class (our combat system completely removed, entire spell range shut down from a counterspell.)
Maybe they are too embarressed to come back to the forums. One of the last things I remember hearing was about how they were going to look at the prot tree, and then that they were happy with it.
Apparently they were so happy that they waited nearly a year to go and finally fix the redoubt-anticipation conflict, make imp devotion aura slightly more useful, and fix reckoning so it was less buggy.
None of those changes have anything to do with both factions getting hybrids or any other BC stuff. They are obvious things that should have been fixed in 1.9 or shortly there after. *sigh*
To the last poster. Ya, they said they would be fixing protection, guess what, they lied. They have lied to the pally community ever since the game came out. Quit or get used to being lied to. I quit, others might like being abused by people they give money to.
It could be worse. In the thread regarding the complete castration of the UI in TBC they could have called your class out specifically... oh wait.
The only thing that makes being a paladin tolerable is my ability to actually stand in a fight and pound seal/judge combos while still being able to cleanse and heal without spending 2 seconds fumbling for a target. I get to play a hitter like I enjoy and still perform critical raid functions. It's win-win.
Blizzard can't have that, now can they? Let's nerf paladins in 100% of the game so Warlocks in PvP can be even deadlier than they are now. I don't claim to be a PvP master, but by my estimation I only win fights against BAD warlocks these days. It might be tolerable if there was an AE cleanse coming down the tubes but that, too, would be imbalanced.
An AE cleanse? As much as I hate more healing power, that is a good idea.
Holy Cleansing Attempts to remove 1 poison, magic, and disease effect from party members in range.
How does this help? Warlocks with Unstable Affliction. They put it up, we bubble and cleanse away, immunce from the silence and damage effects. A perfect counter.
However, that might make paladins good, so rest assured it will never be implemented. And I still say that our heals need to be instant cast, to put us back on the front lines.
When a developer/CM is discussing a fundamental change to an year+ old system and cites a *barf* "class-defining" ability in the same sentence? Yeah, it's hard not to feel the love -- In the buttocks.
Apologies for alluding to quotes and not providing them. ...but for the most part the only people these changes really have effected are healing/cleansing classes.[/quote] I want to say that was Tseric, but I don't have the WoW-forum post in front of me to check. At any rate, it's authoritative and true-blue, unfortunately.
One of the alleged goals of this expansion was to improve the opportunities for "casual" players to excel. Given that I'm a casual player IN a casual guild that has been very successful in BWL after just over a year I :boggle: over that in general, but I digress... Does this change not fly in the face of that "make game accessible, RARRR!" philosophy? Making a task require skill isn't a bad thing. It's how it was in beta before I discovered stuff like PallyPower, CTRA, CastParty, et al, but how does this fit? I don't see how fighting mobs/players AND the UI is a good thing. I also find it hard to believe the post-MC content was not designed with the full knowledge that cleansing/decursing is readily hotkeyed.
We'll have to wait and see, I guess, but I'm dreading this release more and more with each passing day. I want to bury my head in the sands of Silithus and wait for this bad dream to be over. But I can't do that - my rogue needs to hit 60.
2) Blizzard are holding out on giving the paladin community any feedback because we will have the most. Perhaps they arent going to give us any feedback until TBC has been released and we will have the first class patch?
Which, of course, would lead to a debacle not unlike what happened to paladins near the release of WoW in November 2004.
No... the paladin changes are almost certainly set, and will only receive minor tweaking. The game is entering closed beta, and Blizzard are probably going to be loath to change up paladin mechanics right before release again.
No feedback was solicited nor received after the initial round of previews.
I remember the SoC bug taking forever to fix, then they made another bug. Did anybody ask for that? Hell no!
I remember when i was in my level30s 1½ year ago having fun with 3 of my irl friends. I was doing quite well on the damage front compared to mage, rogue, warrior. In mid 50s we split up med goind hardcore and them going horde casuals.
I remember when i was lvl57 making Hi SoC damage with a crappy 2 hander. Now i do the same damage with full epic BWL/AQ gear and Sulfuras. Whats that about.
Now my alt hunters pet does the same damage as me with a 1hander. My shaman has about 250 sustained dps with just a few epics.
Now my alt rogue is nearly doing the same dps sustained as my pally and it is in mid 40s.
The one thing that really clue me in about Blizzard and how they treat the Paladin class was a little event that occurred shortly before patch 1.9.
Blue posted on the WoW-EU forums that they just "hot fixed" a problem with Seal of Command.
Now, "hot fixes" are for emergency items that are "game breaking" such as Reckoning holding unlimited charges and allowing Paladins to one-shot major bosses. If it is a minor bug, they won't fix it until the next maintenance day at the earliest.
So, what did Blizzard fix? What was so "game breaking" that they had to "hot fix" it? Did they finally correct the "spell not ready" bug for SoC?
Nope. Apparently, they "hot fixed" the old judgement effect of SoC. If you remember, pre-1.9, if you judged Command on a target, you could stun the target and they would recieve additional damage. I think it was 68 at R5.
The "hot fix" was that a target would still receive damage even if the target was immune to stun. So, if you judged Command on a target, then poped SoJ and stunned the target three times, the target woudl be immune from all subsequent stuns. However, if SoJ proced, the target was immune from the stun but still get that whopping 68 points of damage.
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If only it were that simple...
Wouldnt life be great? Throw up a YTMND and get a blue response answering all your questions concisely and without being condescending about it?
You could always try!
Why the hell do we even try anymore. You'd think after 2 years of this bullcrap we'd realise they just don't care.
I can only assume the following 2 scenarios could be taking place:
1) Blizzard doesn't give a s**t about us and are trying to make the paladin look cool so loads of newbies will roll the class when TBC comes out. An example of trying to make them look cool is giving blood elf pictures on the TBC map tier 3 armor and a beefy 2 hander.
2) Blizzard are holding out on giving the paladin community any feedback because we will have the most. Perhaps they arent going to give us any feedback until TBC has been released and we will have the first class patch?
One of the posts made saying why do we even try anymore, my answer would be because the class has great potential and does function even though it has some of the worst downfalls of any class (our combat system completely removed, entire spell range shut down from a counterspell.)
- Reeve
Blizzard already stated they would not be doing class patches any longer. Say goodbye to your second theory.
He was personally replying to the hunters yesterday. Maybe it was their review ^^?
Maybe they are too embarressed to come back to the forums. One of the last things I remember hearing was about how they were going to look at the prot tree, and then that they were happy with it.
Apparently they were so happy that they waited nearly a year to go and finally fix the redoubt-anticipation conflict, make imp devotion aura slightly more useful, and fix reckoning so it was less buggy.
None of those changes have anything to do with both factions getting hybrids or any other BC stuff. They are obvious things that should have been fixed in 1.9 or shortly there after. *sigh*
To the last poster. Ya, they said they would be fixing protection, guess what, they lied. They have lied to the pally community ever since the game came out. Quit or get used to being lied to. I quit, others might like being abused by people they give money to.
It could be worse. In the thread regarding the complete castration of the UI in TBC they could have called your class out specifically... oh wait.
The only thing that makes being a paladin tolerable is my ability to actually stand in a fight and pound seal/judge combos while still being able to cleanse and heal without spending 2 seconds fumbling for a target. I get to play a hitter like I enjoy and still perform critical raid functions. It's win-win.
Blizzard can't have that, now can they? Let's nerf paladins in 100% of the game so Warlocks in PvP can be even deadlier than they are now. I don't claim to be a PvP master, but by my estimation I only win fights against BAD warlocks these days. It might be tolerable if there was an AE cleanse coming down the tubes but that, too, would be imbalanced.
An AE cleanse? As much as I hate more healing power, that is a good idea.
Holy Cleansing
Attempts to remove 1 poison, magic, and disease effect from party members in range.
How does this help? Warlocks with Unstable Affliction. They put it up, we bubble and cleanse away, immunce from the silence and damage effects. A perfect counter.
However, that might make paladins good, so rest assured it will never be implemented. And I still say that our heals need to be instant cast, to put us back on the front lines.
since they are nerfing decursive, I doubt we will get an AOE cleanse, even though it would make sense.
My Apologies for Doing this...
As i Am on the European Servers...
I read the American Forums & I have just one one Question to Ask
How an Earth Do you put up with those sanctimonious Tossers Cinead & Gregthesocalled great.
They really are arrogant pricks..
Please feel free to pass this on to them in spades
When a developer/CM is discussing a fundamental change to an year+ old system and cites a *barf* "class-defining" ability in the same sentence? Yeah, it's hard not to feel the love -- In the buttocks.
Apologies for alluding to quotes and not providing them. ...but for the most part the only people these changes really have effected are healing/cleansing classes.[/quote] I want to say that was Tseric, but I don't have the WoW-forum post in front of me to check. At any rate, it's authoritative and true-blue, unfortunately.
One of the alleged goals of this expansion was to improve the opportunities for "casual" players to excel. Given that I'm a casual player IN a casual guild that has been very successful in BWL after just over a year I :boggle: over that in general, but I digress... Does this change not fly in the face of that "make game accessible, RARRR!" philosophy? Making a task require skill isn't a bad thing. It's how it was in beta before I discovered stuff like PallyPower, CTRA, CastParty, et al, but how does this fit? I don't see how fighting mobs/players AND the UI is a good thing. I also find it hard to believe the post-MC content was not designed with the full knowledge that cleansing/decursing is readily hotkeyed.
We'll have to wait and see, I guess, but I'm dreading this release more and more with each passing day. I want to bury my head in the sands of Silithus and wait for this bad dream to be over. But I can't do that - my rogue needs to hit 60.
2) Blizzard are holding out on giving the paladin community any feedback because we will have the most. Perhaps they arent going to give us any feedback until TBC has been released and we will have the first class patch?
Which, of course, would lead to a debacle not unlike what happened to paladins near the release of WoW in November 2004.
No... the paladin changes are almost certainly set, and will only receive minor tweaking. The game is entering closed beta, and Blizzard are probably going to be loath to change up paladin mechanics right before release again.
No feedback was solicited nor received after the initial round of previews.
What you see now is pretty much what you'll get.
I remember the SoC bug taking forever to fix, then they made another bug. Did anybody ask for that? Hell no!
I remember when i was in my level30s 1½ year ago having fun with 3 of my irl friends. I was doing quite well on the damage front compared to mage, rogue, warrior. In mid 50s we split up med goind hardcore and them going horde casuals.
I remember when i was lvl57 making Hi SoC damage with a crappy 2 hander. Now i do the same damage with full epic BWL/AQ gear and Sulfuras. Whats that about.
Now my alt hunters pet does the same damage as me with a 1hander. My shaman has about 250 sustained dps with just a few epics.
Now my alt rogue is nearly doing the same dps sustained as my pally and it is in mid 40s.
The one thing that really clue me in about Blizzard and how they treat the Paladin class was a little event that occurred shortly before patch 1.9.
Blue posted on the WoW-EU forums that they just "hot fixed" a problem with Seal of Command.
Now, "hot fixes" are for emergency items that are "game breaking" such as Reckoning holding unlimited charges and allowing Paladins to one-shot major bosses. If it is a minor bug, they won't fix it until the next maintenance day at the earliest.
So, what did Blizzard fix? What was so "game breaking" that they had to "hot fix" it? Did they finally correct the "spell not ready" bug for SoC?
Nope. Apparently, they "hot fixed" the old judgement effect of SoC. If you remember, pre-1.9, if you judged Command on a target, you could stun the target and they would recieve additional damage. I think it was 68 at R5.
The "hot fix" was that a target would still receive damage even if the target was immune to stun. So, if you judged Command on a target, then poped SoJ and stunned the target three times, the target woudl be immune from all subsequent stuns. However, if SoJ proced, the target was immune from the stun but still get that whopping 68 points of damage.
Paladins doing "extra" damage!!! Oh, no! Hotfix now!
Yep, they hot fixed an effect that 99% of the Paladins weren't even aware of and an effect that would change in two months.
That showed me Blizzard's view of Paladins. They have no clue.
Aren't there two or three other examples of that in the last year?
Kinda seems malicious at the macro level...
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